Friday, October 31, 2008

Two Different People

"One of my mentors was John Mariucci, who told me that I was more than just a coach and that I needed to reach out and help the growth of the game throughout the state. I have always remembered that and, as a result, have always tried to do as much as I could to help the coaches, administrators and volunteers to grow the game."
--Herb Brooks

"Gophers coach Don Lucia said his team never would give up a home game to play in a future showcase..."
--Minneapolis Star-Tribune

22 comments:

John said...

Lol!

USAFA Bulldog said...

And of course Woog wouldn't ever have a non-MN player on the team, which the fans would hold over the other MN teams fans heads.

Lucia has no problem having non-MN players, because it helps them win (completely understandable). The fans seemed to have forgotten about the "pride on ice" thing because of winning.

Anonymous said...

Anyone stop to think it's probably not totally up to Lucia? I doubt it's Lucia who mandates they play three non-conference homes games each year...

RR said...

usafa bulldog: You obviously don't know what you are talking about in making your statement "Woog wouldn't ever have a non-Mn player on the team".

Do a little research before you reveal how uninformed you are. Steve MacSwain (Anchorage,AK 84-87) John Blue (San Jose, CA 85-87) and Frank Pietrangelo (Port Robinson, Ontario 83-86) all played for the Gophers while Woog was coaching at Minnesota. All were outstanding players.

There have also been 37 Canadians that have played for Minnesota over the years. Players have also come from Wisconsin, Colorado, North Dakota, Michigan, Washington State, Wales and Austria.

Anonymous said...

Minnesota directly lead to the growth of hockey at wisconsin, UND and UMD. How many rivals do they really need?

Anonymous said...

Right, this all about the promotion of Hockey in Minnesota. LOL. I call BS. Jutting let slip in the article what this is all about.

"When you get right down to it," Jutting said, "you have to support programs. We have 23 athletic programs and 600-some athletes."

So Minnesota should give up a game at Mariucci in which they will will sell 10,000+ tickets to split 19,500 tickets at the Xcel to support the athletic programs at SCSU, MSU-M, and tUMD that can't support themselves. And at this point 19,500 is a pipe dream until this thing sells out. Which it's not close to doing right now if reports are accurate.

If this actually had anything to do with the promotion of Hockey there might be a point here. Instead the other three schools want some old fashioned charity to support their other programs which make no money.

And this reported by the guy who whines year in and year out about charity in the Big Ten. Nice hypocrisy there Maize.

Anonymous said...

Is there another fan base in sports that whines as much as the Gophers?

Anonymous said...

Who from North Dakota played for the gophers?

hammy said...

Yeah, MN really needs this to grow the game. I guess that is why the ticket sales are through the roof, right? After all, the state only has hundreds of youth and HS hockey teams, five D1 college teams (as well as many other D3 teams), and an NHL franchise. Then add in a few hundred kids playing D1 hockey, a healthy amount of local players being drafted by the NHL every year, and more hockey rinks (and lots of access to those opportunities) per capita than just about anywhere. Yep, you sure nailed it Maize... there is a major need for this event to help grow the game here. LOL

Not that this should have to be said but this isn't the mid-70s where there were two D1 programs in MN and the opportunities for kids were much more scarce. It is an apples to oranges comparison when you look at the overall circumstances within the state when these two men coached at the school.

Let's call it this event for what it is... it is basically an attempt by two programs to do a money grab via increased ticket revenue when compared to what they would have received if they simply held the game in their home rink. Only a complete idiot would truly believe this is about growing the game.

Mankato's program ought to know this money grab stuff better than anybody since they already played the role of a "sell out" for the almighty dollar by giving up a home game to play the Gophers at XCel. I suppose that was about growing the game in the state too.

blah blah blah said...

anon 6:42--

Seriously? Dan Irman, Ryan Potulny, Grant Potulny, Ryan Kraft just to name a few...

Anonymous said...

.....and refusing to give up a home game to participate in this event is not driven by money?

Kevin said...

Anonymous @ 6:36: In case you weren't aware, 10,000+ isn't that far off from half of 19,500. Especially if you consider how many tickets for home games at Mariucci are discounted student tickets.

rr said...

John Mariucci didn't have to worry about Title 9 way back when either.

Anonymous said...

rr I believe the players that you listed were recruited to the gophers by Buetow. As for Woog please list the names of the Non Minnesotans that he recruited.

Franklen said...

The X has only had over 19k packed into it a couple of times. The typical Wild sell out is approximately 18,500 with the 500 being standing room. On top of that there is loss of parking and concessions revenue. It all makes a difference compared to 10k at your own arena.

Not really taking a side here, just adding facts. I will say, though, that if the the organizers were truly concerned about promoting hockey in Minnesota they would have held the event later in the year, promoted the hell out of it, held other events around it, and made damn sure that both games were on tv. None of that happened.

rr said...

Anon 1:46-- In responding to usafa bulldog's post I made the point that Woog did in fact have players that were not from Minnesota. I am aware that they weren't recruited by Woog. I didn't say Woog recruited those players. I didn't imply that either.

However the larger point I was making is that there have been many non-Minnesotans playing for the Gophers over the years. Even John Mariucci had non-Minnesotans on some of his teams. So did Glen Sonmor. There has never been a policy of "Minnesota players only" prior to Coach Lucia coming to Minnesota even though it appears at times some people believe that to be true. Woog did a great job at Minnesota with the approach he took. He won a lot of games with that approach(390-187-40). Three Hobey Baker winners, no National Championships though.

I can't speak for anyone but myself but I've never cared where players come from so long as they want to be part of the program and play a role in making the team successful. The fact that most of the Gophers over the years were from Minnesota is pretty cool and it's also pretty cool that a lot of other Minnesota kids have gotten the opportunity to play college hockey elsewhere.

To me that really is the overall embodiment of a slogan like "Minnesota's Pride on Ice." It is a manifestation of the efforts at the grass roots level in Minnesota to grow the game and provide as many Minnesota kids as possible the opportunity to develop and get a college education as a result of those efforts.

The answer to your other question is that beyond those three, there weren't any other non-Minnesotan's playing for Minnesota during Woog's years. I do remember he recruited Brian Swanson but he ended up at CC.

Blah, blah blah: There were nine other North Dakota natives that played at Minnesota prior to Grant Potulny, Ryan Potulny and Danny Irmen.

USAFA Bulldog said...

If they weren't recruited by Woog they don't count.

I'm glad you didn't care, but the fact is the majority of the fans at the time did care. They cared enough to rub it in other Minnesotan teams fans faces. They cared enough to say "your team may be better, but we have more Minnesotans" which I heard on tons of occasions. It was a point of pride for the UMTC fanbase.

rr said...

usafa bulldog-- A disagreement I do have with you is twofold: One is your over-generalization that virtually all Gopher fans lord over UMD fans with the "we have more Minnesotans than you" gripe. Writing as though you know how the majority of Gopher fans feel about something is downright silly. Go to a game at Mariucci some time and look around. If you can come away from the experience thinking that virtually everyone there thinks the same is delusional. You are making a mountain out of a mole hill.

The second point is you write as though having an all Minnesota roster as opposed to winning are mutually exclusive concepts. Winning has been a by-product of either approach. I can tell you that either way they are quite satisfying. Herbie won three NC's with all Minnesota teams and Lucia has won two NC's with some non-Minnesotans.

I will say this though, the internet has magnified many peoples perceptions about what a fan of a particular school thinks, or says, or looks like or acts like based a an extremely small self selected sample. My take is the vast majority of fans that buy tickets and go to college hockey games don't even know blogs or comment sections like this even exist. They'd be kind of surprised at the overall tone of a lot of the discussions. Prior to the internet and venues such as this one, I can't ever remember caring about the fans of any other schools or what they thought about. I had limited or no contact with them other than maybe seeing some at a game. I liked it better then because there sure seemed to be a lot less animosity between fan-bases. Or stated slightly differently animosity between a small number of fans that congregate on the internet.

I think that basically you are wrong for suggesting that a Gopher fan can have either pride for their team or a winning record. They go hand in hand regardless as to where the players come from.

rr said...

usafa bulldog: I have a question for you regarding your direct quote. Who exactly are you quoting when you said "Your teams may be better, but we have more Minnesotans"?

Sounds to me like what you are doing is merely making things up as you go along to conform to your own pre-concieved notions.

Whatever makes you feels good.

Ryan said...

You should probably leave Ryan Kraft out of players from ND who have played for the Gophers. Yes, he was born there, but he played all of his hockey in Moorhead prior to attending Minnesota.

One other note - Woog wanted Brian Swanson on the team..

USAFA Bulldog said...

The quote I was making was one I heard many times growing up in Northern MN, so prior to the internet. I shouldn't have said majority, but there certainly was a good amount of them.

And no, I wouldn't say winning and having an all MN lineup are exclusive. However I haven't heard much if any complaining in a long time about having non-Minnesotans in the lineup, which is amazing considering how much a point of pride it was for the fans.

I'm kind of mixed whether this is a money grab by the schools. Yes, money I am sure is a factor (as it always is), but I wonder if this also could be looked at as trying to get a huge tournament type thing going, a la the beanpot. In that sense it could be trying to grow, growing into an event that sells out the X.

USAFA Bulldog said...

And yes, your point about the internet amplifying things is a good one and is worth thinking about, although not applicable in this case.